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	<title>Comments on: Agricultural Revolution or Complication?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/</link>
	<description>Primal Man living in a Modern World</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 09 Sep 2010 17:28:39 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Tori</title>
		<link>http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/comment-page-1/#comment-48482</link>
		<dc:creator>Tori</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Aug 2010 15:39:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sonofgrok.com/?p=1023#comment-48482</guid>
		<description>I love Jared Diamond.  I was an anthropology major in college, and he is the first anthropologist I ever really took note of, because I love is writing.  It makes sense to me, it is clear, and has a lot more science in it then a lot of other anthropologists I could mention.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love Jared Diamond.  I was an anthropology major in college, and he is the first anthropologist I ever really took note of, because I love is writing.  It makes sense to me, it is clear, and has a lot more science in it then a lot of other anthropologists I could mention.</p>
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		<title>By: DML</title>
		<link>http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/comment-page-1/#comment-4920</link>
		<dc:creator>DML</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 May 2009 05:33:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sonofgrok.com/?p=1023#comment-4920</guid>
		<description>How about eliminating subsidies completely?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How about eliminating subsidies completely?</p>
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		<title>By: Katherine</title>
		<link>http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/comment-page-1/#comment-4812</link>
		<dc:creator>Katherine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 02:41:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sonofgrok.com/?p=1023#comment-4812</guid>
		<description>Oh no, typo ^ should be &quot;done&quot; not &quot;doen&quot; obviously. I just returned to add that if you think I&#039;m derailing a bit, we can move this discussion wherever you think it is appropriate on your blog. I meant to say that above but I forgot, too many points to keep track of!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh no, typo ^ should be &#8220;done&#8221; not &#8220;doen&#8221; obviously. I just returned to add that if you think I&#8217;m derailing a bit, we can move this discussion wherever you think it is appropriate on your blog. I meant to say that above but I forgot, too many points to keep track of!</p>
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		<title>By: Katherine</title>
		<link>http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/comment-page-1/#comment-4809</link>
		<dc:creator>Katherine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 02:16:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sonofgrok.com/?p=1023#comment-4809</guid>
		<description>Damn, I was hoping that I was coming across as reasonable but I guess my anger at bad information shone through and I got labelled as a troll. Thank you for responding; I guess I did take it a bit far in asking why you hadn&#039;t adopted this lifestyle already - I did actually read your whole post but your clarification certainly helped me understand your intent better. I guess I am a bit hyper-sensitive to apparent hypocrisy on the internet.

In asking why you hadn&#039;t adopted this lifestyle I certainly didn&#039;t imagine doing that in the US. How about Africa, or a Pacific Island? The locals would certainly teach you enough to fit in. A friend of mine went to a Pacific Island as part of a program to help improve the lives of the people there - free food and lodging, no property taxes in exchange for a little technical expertise and practical skill.

As for the part which most provoked me: &quot;toxins&quot; in peanuts. A lot of people on the internet use the word &quot;toxin&quot; without really understanding anything about it, which is the main reason I asked. Thanks for the link; however it seems that according to your link: &quot;Crops which are frequently affected include cereals (maize, sorghum, pearl millet, rice, wheat), oilseeds (peanut, soybean, sunflower, cotton), spices (chile peppers, black pepper, coriander, turmeric, ginger), and tree nuts (almond, pistachio, walnut, coconut, brazil nut).&quot; I&#039;d be interested in finding out whether you avoid eating any of the rest of these crops that are prone to be contaminated with Alfatoxins, and exactly which nuts you use to make your nut butter (I hope it is not one in that list). Also in your comment above you seem to be implying that 1) all legumes are full of toxins and 2) that the toxins are an integral part of peanuts, rather than a contaminant. 

Finally, a well-proven fact in the medical profession is that the damage done by any toxic substance is proportional to the dose, hence maximum safe levels being set by various government-run food safety groups. The Wikipedia link you provided states that the level of Alfatoxins in peanut butter &quot;is usually far below the US Food and Drug Administration&#039;s (FDA) recommended safe level.&quot; So it bothers me that you are frightening people with misleading information about peanuts/peanut butter. If you wanted to be less misleading while still giving your views on peanut butter you could mention this but then state you don&#039;t think the safe limit set by the FDA is low enough, rather than &quot;peanuts are full of toxins&quot; which is clearly untrue. 

I hope this comment comes across as more reasonable than my previous &quot;trolling&quot; post. I genuinely admire people who strive to be healthy (I am trying to find the motivation to exercise more myself), but the amount of misinformation on the internet is vast and if I can reduce it just slightly, then I have certainly doen a good deed ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Damn, I was hoping that I was coming across as reasonable but I guess my anger at bad information shone through and I got labelled as a troll. Thank you for responding; I guess I did take it a bit far in asking why you hadn&#8217;t adopted this lifestyle already &#8211; I did actually read your whole post but your clarification certainly helped me understand your intent better. I guess I am a bit hyper-sensitive to apparent hypocrisy on the internet.</p>
<p>In asking why you hadn&#8217;t adopted this lifestyle I certainly didn&#8217;t imagine doing that in the US. How about Africa, or a Pacific Island? The locals would certainly teach you enough to fit in. A friend of mine went to a Pacific Island as part of a program to help improve the lives of the people there &#8211; free food and lodging, no property taxes in exchange for a little technical expertise and practical skill.</p>
<p>As for the part which most provoked me: &#8220;toxins&#8221; in peanuts. A lot of people on the internet use the word &#8220;toxin&#8221; without really understanding anything about it, which is the main reason I asked. Thanks for the link; however it seems that according to your link: &#8220;Crops which are frequently affected include cereals (maize, sorghum, pearl millet, rice, wheat), oilseeds (peanut, soybean, sunflower, cotton), spices (chile peppers, black pepper, coriander, turmeric, ginger), and tree nuts (almond, pistachio, walnut, coconut, brazil nut).&#8221; I&#8217;d be interested in finding out whether you avoid eating any of the rest of these crops that are prone to be contaminated with Alfatoxins, and exactly which nuts you use to make your nut butter (I hope it is not one in that list). Also in your comment above you seem to be implying that 1) all legumes are full of toxins and 2) that the toxins are an integral part of peanuts, rather than a contaminant. </p>
<p>Finally, a well-proven fact in the medical profession is that the damage done by any toxic substance is proportional to the dose, hence maximum safe levels being set by various government-run food safety groups. The Wikipedia link you provided states that the level of Alfatoxins in peanut butter &#8220;is usually far below the US Food and Drug Administration&#8217;s (FDA) recommended safe level.&#8221; So it bothers me that you are frightening people with misleading information about peanuts/peanut butter. If you wanted to be less misleading while still giving your views on peanut butter you could mention this but then state you don&#8217;t think the safe limit set by the FDA is low enough, rather than &#8220;peanuts are full of toxins&#8221; which is clearly untrue. </p>
<p>I hope this comment comes across as more reasonable than my previous &#8220;trolling&#8221; post. I genuinely admire people who strive to be healthy (I am trying to find the motivation to exercise more myself), but the amount of misinformation on the internet is vast and if I can reduce it just slightly, then I have certainly doen a good deed <img src='http://www.sonofgrok.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Son of Grok</title>
		<link>http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/comment-page-1/#comment-4773</link>
		<dc:creator>Son of Grok</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 May 2009 02:43:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sonofgrok.com/?p=1023#comment-4773</guid>
		<description>Katherine,
The name of the bad stuff in peanuts IS &quot;aflatoxins&quot;.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aflatoxin

Peanuts are notorious for being high in aflatoxins.

As for living a truly hunter gatherer lifestyle off in the country somewhere... we don&#039;t really live in a situation that allows that. You can find some remote piece of land in some remote part of the U.S and no matter how self sustainable you manage to make it (which requires considerable skill that I don&#039;t possess), Uncle Sam is still going to come knocking for property taxes. Believe me, if I really thought could get away with retiring to a quiet life in the country then i would.

As for why am I blogging about it on the internet? I found this info on the internet from Marks blogs and it helped me to know end. If I can help anyone with the same info then I have certainly done a good deed.

I think in your trolling you are focusing too much on the wrong part of the message. I do not say that everyone should instantly run off and live a hunter gatherer lifestyle. I say that we should take the lessons we can from this lifestyle and incorporate it where we can into our modern lives. In fact, I am pretty sure that right in this post I point out that the extremem view of things is probably a little unreasonable in modern practice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Katherine,<br />
The name of the bad stuff in peanuts IS &#8220;aflatoxins&#8221;.<br />
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aflatoxin" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aflatoxin</a></p>
<p>Peanuts are notorious for being high in aflatoxins.</p>
<p>As for living a truly hunter gatherer lifestyle off in the country somewhere&#8230; we don&#8217;t really live in a situation that allows that. You can find some remote piece of land in some remote part of the U.S and no matter how self sustainable you manage to make it (which requires considerable skill that I don&#8217;t possess), Uncle Sam is still going to come knocking for property taxes. Believe me, if I really thought could get away with retiring to a quiet life in the country then i would.</p>
<p>As for why am I blogging about it on the internet? I found this info on the internet from Marks blogs and it helped me to know end. If I can help anyone with the same info then I have certainly done a good deed.</p>
<p>I think in your trolling you are focusing too much on the wrong part of the message. I do not say that everyone should instantly run off and live a hunter gatherer lifestyle. I say that we should take the lessons we can from this lifestyle and incorporate it where we can into our modern lives. In fact, I am pretty sure that right in this post I point out that the extremem view of things is probably a little unreasonable in modern practice.</p>
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		<title>By: Katherine</title>
		<link>http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/comment-page-1/#comment-4771</link>
		<dc:creator>Katherine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 May 2009 01:49:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sonofgrok.com/?p=1023#comment-4771</guid>
		<description>I nearly thought you were sensible, Son of Grok, until you mentioned &quot;toxins&quot;. If there was really stuff in peanuts that was bad for you, you&#039;d tell us what it is and tell us your sources. If you&#039;re just trying to say they are bad for you, that isn&#039;t the same. 

I actually came to ask if you think it would be a good idea for everyone to embrace this tribal lifestyle, rather than the division of labour lifestyle that we have now which involves medical advances, clean water to drink etc. If you are so enamoured of this lifestyle then how come you are blogging about it on the internet rather than going to live in a country where this hunter-gatherer lifestyle would be possible?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I nearly thought you were sensible, Son of Grok, until you mentioned &#8220;toxins&#8221;. If there was really stuff in peanuts that was bad for you, you&#8217;d tell us what it is and tell us your sources. If you&#8217;re just trying to say they are bad for you, that isn&#8217;t the same. </p>
<p>I actually came to ask if you think it would be a good idea for everyone to embrace this tribal lifestyle, rather than the division of labour lifestyle that we have now which involves medical advances, clean water to drink etc. If you are so enamoured of this lifestyle then how come you are blogging about it on the internet rather than going to live in a country where this hunter-gatherer lifestyle would be possible?</p>
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		<title>By: TrailGrrl</title>
		<link>http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/comment-page-1/#comment-4152</link>
		<dc:creator>TrailGrrl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Apr 2009 01:04:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sonofgrok.com/?p=1023#comment-4152</guid>
		<description>I haven&#039;t quite given up peanut butter.  I may be hardwired for it or something.  Maybe when this latest canister is empty I&#039;ll try to wean myself.  I do like other nut butters, but nothing as much as peanut butter.  The schedule you propose is sort of like vacation... get up when you are ready, do some stuff, eat when you are hungry, play, then go to bed when you are ready.  You notice that your appetite changes... you don&#039;t get fixated on &quot;oh I need to eat&quot; although I rarely do that now that I am Primal and pretty much eat when I am hungry.  People want to know what I am doing to lose weight and I say I eat a lot of meat and not much sugar or bread or cereal.  Then they say that they like their treats too much so they&#039;d rather exercise more.  All I can say is that I&#039;m fitter now than when I was a flabby marathon runner and triathlete, and I don&#039;t have sugar fits with big highs and lows.

TrailGrrl</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I haven&#8217;t quite given up peanut butter.  I may be hardwired for it or something.  Maybe when this latest canister is empty I&#8217;ll try to wean myself.  I do like other nut butters, but nothing as much as peanut butter.  The schedule you propose is sort of like vacation&#8230; get up when you are ready, do some stuff, eat when you are hungry, play, then go to bed when you are ready.  You notice that your appetite changes&#8230; you don&#8217;t get fixated on &#8220;oh I need to eat&#8221; although I rarely do that now that I am Primal and pretty much eat when I am hungry.  People want to know what I am doing to lose weight and I say I eat a lot of meat and not much sugar or bread or cereal.  Then they say that they like their treats too much so they&#8217;d rather exercise more.  All I can say is that I&#8217;m fitter now than when I was a flabby marathon runner and triathlete, and I don&#8217;t have sugar fits with big highs and lows.</p>
<p>TrailGrrl</p>
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		<title>By: Justin from GymJunkies</title>
		<link>http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/comment-page-1/#comment-4123</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin from GymJunkies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Apr 2009 23:40:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sonofgrok.com/?p=1023#comment-4123</guid>
		<description>This is pretty interesting.  Ive been a big fan of the primal approach from Vic and Mark Sisson, Im gonna look into this a bunch more... 

Good post man!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is pretty interesting.  Ive been a big fan of the primal approach from Vic and Mark Sisson, Im gonna look into this a bunch more&#8230; </p>
<p>Good post man!</p>
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		<title>By: Son of Grok</title>
		<link>http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/comment-page-1/#comment-3961</link>
		<dc:creator>Son of Grok</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Apr 2009 19:08:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sonofgrok.com/?p=1023#comment-3961</guid>
		<description>Questions,

Answers:
1 - No. Peanuts are a legume and are full of toxins. I make my own nutbutter at home from real nuts.

2 - Occasionally I have organic cream cheese, sour cream or whole milk cheese. I also regularly eat real organic butter.

3 - Depends on your definition of &quot;a lot&quot;. I do regularly use olive oil though yes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Questions,</p>
<p>Answers:<br />
1 &#8211; No. Peanuts are a legume and are full of toxins. I make my own nutbutter at home from real nuts.</p>
<p>2 &#8211; Occasionally I have organic cream cheese, sour cream or whole milk cheese. I also regularly eat real organic butter.</p>
<p>3 &#8211; Depends on your definition of &#8220;a lot&#8221;. I do regularly use olive oil though yes.</p>
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		<title>By: questions</title>
		<link>http://www.sonofgrok.com/2009/04/agricultural-revolution-or-complication/comment-page-1/#comment-3959</link>
		<dc:creator>questions</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Apr 2009 19:02:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sonofgrok.com/?p=1023#comment-3959</guid>
		<description>A couple quick food related questions:

1 - do you eat peanut butter?

2 - do you drink/eat WHOLE high-fat dairy products like WHOLE milk (NOT skim milk), whole cheese, real cream, real butter, etc?

3 - do you use a lot of olive oil?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A couple quick food related questions:</p>
<p>1 &#8211; do you eat peanut butter?</p>
<p>2 &#8211; do you drink/eat WHOLE high-fat dairy products like WHOLE milk (NOT skim milk), whole cheese, real cream, real butter, etc?</p>
<p>3 &#8211; do you use a lot of olive oil?</p>
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